You may have seen this reader comment regarding weekly and weekend rentals at Palermo Palm Springs: There's a "craigslist ad for an owner who is trying to get $1k for the Coachella music festival. I like the part where it says 'Sleeps 10.' http://palmsprings.craigslist.org/sub/2192619141.html" The link no longer works but ad still could be found elsewhere on the Internet. Here is the full ad that was on the Internet (the ad also included pictures):
"$1000 / 2br - Condo for Coachella Festival
*2 Story 1350 Sq Ft 2 bd/2 ba Condo in Palermo Community of Palm Springs
*1 Cal King Bed/1 Queen/2 Queen Air Mattresses/Couch folds into Queen Bed (Have comfortably slept 10 people)
*Attached Garage and Backyard with BBQ
*2 Community Pools and Jacuzzis
*Community Clubhouse with Pool Table and Gym
$1000 for Thursday-Monday OBO....make an offer"
Miss Penny Lane says: Thank you for the information.
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44 comments:
That's crazy. We better have extra security that weekend. And make the owners pay an extra fee for it.
Short term rentals are not allowed as per agreement this owner signed with the HOA.That means the HOA is paying for these 40 showers these people would take and the garbage etc. What address is this so that this can be addressed ?
Come on people this has get to stop.
Short term rentals are alive and well especially on Sandy Point. I've seen no less than 6-7 weekend rentals since the beginning of the year at the same townhouse!
Peoples back are to the finicial wall. They are going to do what it takes to survive regardless of the rules.
Do people at Palermo have jobs? Somebody must have a lot of time on their hands to be worrying about this. Shower water is being used! OMG!
I have been considering buying a unit here but after reading this blog I am having second thoughts.
To the last person who posted......if you could care less then we dont want you here...I am sure the trailer park down San Rafael has a few foreclosures you can view. It is a select few renters lack of understanding and civility like you that have caused the drama we have endured the past year or two as an HOA.
If we can find out which unit this is and to be sure to have security notified and call the police at the first blink of anything wrong it should send a message.
I saw the ad on the internet and the ad makes it seem like it is the A type unit 245 Sandy Point but it is not. The rental is a C unit next door at 235 Sandy Point Trail. The rental pictures on the Internet shows the inside.
We bought here because of this blog. It is how we found out about Palermo and are impressed by the spirit and concern for our community. Are all these short term rentals paying hotel taxes to the city of PS?
All vacation rentals must have a permit. And the permit number must be displayed in the vacation rental listing...let me guess...this is our problem child...no permit...the vacation rate is way under market value and they are renting for short term...http://www.vrbo.com/332964 Sandy Point... what a coinky dinky
Someone could report them to the city or to our HOA...who can confirm they are the violators?
The owners that rent their units out on a short term basis due to financial hardships should not be allowed to do this at the expense of the rest of the owners who follow the rules and are also in financial trouble. The HOA dues have gone up due to the additional serves. Why should we all have to absorb this cost. We are ALL trying to survive and should not have to pick up the additional costs of the short term renters. Short term rentals bring down the values of our properties.
It's a matter of integrity.If you bought at Palermo your agreed to follw the rules related to short term rentals. This makes it fair for all.The management is suppose to know whos there and for how long. Renting your place to 10 people so you can make a buck leaves your neighbors next to a motel 6. Also with a shared wall you can hear quite alot. I would be irate if this happens to me and I cannot enjoy the peace and quiet of my own home.
@7:40 You don't need a permit from the city to rent over a month. This ad says 1 month minimum stays, please have someone read it to you.
"the drama we have endured the past year or two as an HOA"
LOL! Can you please specify what drama you have gone through and how short term rentals have caused it?
Short term renters can't be blamed for a lack of atmosphere on the Moon, and getting rid of them will not solve any of your personal issues.
Penny, this thread is getting a little inflammatory on both sides. I don't think this is the kind of face we want to show to the World.
Actually the city requires a permit (and city hotel tax) for renting under 28 days. This is basically your local hotel lobby at work because vacation rentals are forcing them to lower prices to compete. Anything over 28 days the city has no laws on though. I think the Palermo HOA rule is 30 days minimum?
Please! This is now totally out of control. Be a good neighbor for God's sake.
This is just craziness - what I love about Palermo is the honor and respect that we all show each other. Threatening e-mails and hostility is just not what our community is about! As owners we pay hundreds of dollars each month for our HOA to uphold the rules and regulations that govern our community! I contacted Brandi Scott yesterday and she kindly asked that we send her addresses where infractions are taking place (short term rentals, parties, etc)... we should be letting her take care of it. Let's get back to the values that we so love about our special oasis in the desert!
To the 2:06 poster, the owner has now changed the ad to only monthly rentals, the earlier ads on the Web had weekly, so we should all thank this owner for realizing they weren't following the rules. I think sometimes people are renting out short-term (weekly) because they don't know the rules and we should do better in letting them know. We love Palermo and we must all work together.
Hi everyone. I wouldn't get too work up about the comments here because some "out there" ones negative about short term rents it looks like are probably posted by an owner doing short term rents, as a way to divert or deflect attention away from the short-term rents and put a negative light on the residents concerned about the impact that short terms are having on Palermo. Have to give credit to them as it is right of the republican playbook! LOL. But seriously, a resident told me this might happen after hearing about it.
To the above poster, I have to say when I saw that "no one at Palermo works" comment earlier that I thought there could be some monkey business like that (diverting attention from the illegal rentals to going after the concerned residents). I guess when people have money (their weekly rental fees) involved they do that stuff but we don't need to do that at Palermo. Let's all get along. This is such as wonderful community and newcomers who buy and rent out weekly just need to be informed. Have a great day, friends.
I am the one that contacted internet address posted in a previous post related to the offender on Sandy Point.I did say the neighbors are pissed that he choses not to follow the rules he agreed to when he purchased. Sadly he chose to embellish what I wrote by saying"you had better watch you back"(Diverting the attention) I printed what I sent.There is a huge difference between being upset buy a action and threating someones saftey and sense of well being. Again it shows a lack of integrity.Have not seen the registration permit from the PS dept of Finance & Treasury displayed as required by the PS Muncipal Tax code.Weeks back his renters had a dog in the pool and glasses poolside and left a mess.But he made a buck. ADVICE; Do the right thing!
Hi everyone. I for one want to commend the owner for I guess changing his/her ad and stopping weekly rental advertising and only going with monthly so there won't be any NEW ones accepted, but I hope that also means that any weekend/weekly ones previously scheduled will be cancelled.
I want to know where the management and board are in all this. A) Did they inform people that weeklies and weekends are not allowed B) How good was the communication if so many are doing it C) Did they contact owners when they found out D) What is being done now. It seems to me that this was let to fester and that was wrong. So I want to know: WHY was it let to go on for so long??? What is the that reason??? But more important is not to let all this happen again and upset neighbors. Yes, move ahead!
I was here when the dog was at the pool. The "guests" were not staying at the Sandy Point residence above (I live on Sandy Point). It looked like they came from one of the one level units. Can someone confirm this?
Hey all, there might have been two different dog incidents - one a couple weeks after the first and that second one was from over the QS. Any way, I concur with the absence of a management presence on short-term situation has made it worse and made it spread in 2010 to the point we are at now. But that real point that I want to make is that giving people a break on the rules because of their "financial" situation might be fine and good to a point if they bought too high here but some of those renting out short term are BRAND NEW owners who bought low and figured out they can make their mortgage payments all year by renting out weekly during the high season. Are we supposed to let them harm our community when they only have been here a little time? New people are buying now and renting out short term so no sad stories about being bad off financially, okay?
I agree with 5:22. I have been renting here for 2 years now with no problems/complaints. I am on fixed income and it helps me pay my mortgage. People moving in recently and buying foreclosures/short sells do not need help paying their small mortgage.
Coinky dinky?
I am happy at least one owner has removed the weekly rental option (as noted in an earlier post) so thank you for that but with the season nearly over, and most bookings already made, it really doesn't make that much difference, but thanks for the gesture.
@ 5:22- if the HOA shows favoritism and selective enforcement of the rules to people who have lived here longer we open ourselves up to lawsuits. Not a good idea.
Did anyone see the article in the Desert Sun today about imposing fees on under 30 day rentals? Palm Desert is doing it. Great idea for the HOA to do. Also, the problem with enforcement is that Brandi Scott at DRM needs to know who is doing it, or renters can also contact their landlords (VPM or whatever) since they were told this wasn't a vacation rental (weekly) place.
What are the city rules? The article says in PS you must pay a 60 buck fee plus nightly taxes.
You must register with the city of P.S. for vacation properties, and if you rent under a month, you must pay a 10 percent or so tax. The city wants to know about properties not paying the fees and taxes.
I have been watching this thread and must weigh because some important facts has been missing in the discussion. The city government has many rules on vacation rentals, including laws that make renting or staying in illegal ones subject to criminal punishment. It says "Any person who uses, or allows the use of, residential property in violation of the provisions in this chapter is guilty of a misdemeanor for each day in which such residential property is used, or allowed to be used." Also, Every vacation rental property registered within the city of Palm Springs must provide a telephone number for a local contact who is available 24 hours per day, 7 days per week, and who is required to show up at the property within 45 minutes in the event there is a complaint. No amplified outdoor music of any kind is permitted for vacation rentals. A small stereo at the pool is permissible provided the volume be kept at a reasonable level. Reasonable volume meaning a decibel level which will not offend your neighbors. There is a fixed maximum occupancy limit for each rental property based upon the number of bedrooms. A two bedroom unit can't have more than 6 people overnight. The number allowed during the day is limited as well. The city code is No. 1748.
ALSO, The city should notify all homes within 300 feet of vacation homes that it is a vacation rental. The city has a phone number (760) 833-7988 for residents to call to report any violations of ordinance #1748. Once a call is made to that phone number, the local contact person will then be called to respond within the 45 minute time frame. The right to rent a property on a short term basis may be suspended or permanently revoked by the City Manager if there are 4 violations of the Vacation Ordinance within a period of 24 months. Fines for violations are $250 for the first violation and $500 for subsequent violations.
Maybe we can paint something on the sides of the units that rent short term? "Attention! Short Term Rental!!"
You people crack me up!!
Actually that is why the city has these rules, requiring people to registers and pay a fee and nightly bed taxes, so neighbors have a way of knowing because the fact is that short term renters often cause problems (noise, breaking equipment). So if the owners don't register then the city must step in with fines. Owners are REQUIRED to post their tax number in their ads -- and they must put a list of rules required by the city in their units. If these owners followed the city law, no sign would be needed. Where is DRM and the HOA on this? How about fining the owners who are doing this, and adding a fee?
My bet is that another rule not being followed is that owners who rent out yearly, monthly or whatever are supposed to contact DRM with the names and relationship of all renters in advance. Anyone not doing this also should be fined by the HOA. We need to do this to keep Palermo the special place it is.
Sadly, Palermo is already becoming a "special place", in much the same way that North Korea is a "special place". People here have sacrificed much to buy a condo in a place they love, and many of them who aren't able to stay at their homes full time due to other commitments must rent their homes out. For the most part, they choose the tenants wisely - the tenant stays primarily in the owner's home, and the potential for damage is greatest there. Of course there have been infractions - but very few, with little cost to the community. How many times have the police had to be notified of short term renters causing problems? My guess is very few. Those of you who have deputized yourselves to enforce every obscure city regulation or HOA rule should ask yourselves what your motivation really is - and why you would want to infringe on the rights of others to use their own property as they need to in order to keep it. Maybe I am wrong, if you feel that short term (or any renters) have hurt you in some way, feel free to post your grievances here. I for one do not rent my place out, but I would like the option if I have to take a far - off job or just fall on hard times. I have never been woken up by a "rental party", whereas I have been kept up by some owner's dogs. I don't think this is the problem people are making it out to be.
There are MANY renters here, and for the most part they are decent people, just like the owners are. If we infringe on people's right to rent out their units we risk forcing them to leave their units empty, or worse, to foreclose on them. A more sparsely populated community is a much more susceptible to crime.
Lighten up people, live and let live.
@327: I guess it is the job of the HOA to enforce all of the City's laws? Maybe we should get a radar gun and chase down speeders on Indian Canyon just to levy a special HOA "tax" on them. Should we get a neighborhood posse together to go knock on doors to see if people are all "registered" at Palermo ("Papers! Let me see your papers!"). It is tempting if you are part of the majority group (live-in homeowners) to scheme up ways to get minority members of the community to pay more so you can pay less, but we are all entitled to the same rights here.
I agree that all should have the same rights but all also should follow the rules, the HOA's and the city's. The city put these rules in place for a reason and the HOA also put them in place for a reason. I am a second (vacation) owner at Palermo and don't want these weekenders and such breaking the HOA and city laws. It brings us all down. I really don't see the "get them to pay more so you can pay less" comments at all. I also am very very happy that an full-timer lives next door to us and watches our place. Thank you. Yes, are entitled to same rights but illegal rentals aren't rights. I'm glad of the focus on it.
I think was is odd in this discussion is that under 30 days rentals aren't allowed by the HOA and that even if you do it furtively, the city has laws governing them that must be obeyed. End of story.
Amen! Let's end this discussion and just enjoy living where we do.
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